[Cro Dreoilin] "Shoulds"

Sebastian jsburns at gmail.com
Sat Nov 26 10:53:49 MST 2011 

I should follow the god(s) that call to me because I respect them and wish
to build a lasting relationship with them.
Or in some cases, "I should follow the god(s) that call to me because
otherwise they will be pissed."

On Sat, Nov 26, 2011 at 9:16 AM, Donna Miller <dmiller at faerealm.com> wrote:

> Okay, let me go at it.  I do not follow Celtic spiritual traditions, being
> more drawn to ancient Persian spiritual traditions.  I follow Celtic
> musical traditions which is tied into Celtic spirituality no matter what
> the Irish will tell you.  I still know nothing about the Celtic
> reconstructionist traditions other than what Chris and Kelly taught us at
> the Jeffco CUUPS event.
>
> My own take on religion is that it exists, not for the god(s)'s sake but
> for the purpose of building society.  The rules of the religion will mirror
> the religious community's strongest values, not the other way around.  What
> "offends the god" is what disrupts society.  Religion exists for man, not
> for god(dess)(s).  Yet the worship of a god strengthens the value that said
> god represents.
>
> What are the shoulds that build Celtic Reconstructionist society?  You are
> very open in belief but there should be guidelines set down that are
> forbidden.  Usually they have more to do to the needs of the people in it
> than the tradition at hand.
>
> Enlighten me.
>
> DSM
>
>
> On 11/26/2011 8:39 AM, Kelley Forbes wrote:
>
>> Alrighty, let's play the game:
>>
>> "You should follow the God(s) that you feel call to you," because -- ?
>>
>>
>> -- Kelley & Chris.
>>
>> Katie Murphy wrote:
>>
>>> Yes, definitely, you should follow the God(s) that you feel call to you,
>>> rather than the God(s) that your parents/family/what have you expect you to
>>> follow/worship. Like, Brad's parents expect him to be Christian but it was
>>> never really true to him.
>>>
>>> However, I can understand the importance of stopping and checking
>>> ourselves for outside (say, Christian) moralistic views when it comes to
>>> approaching daily life and our Gods.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Nov 25, 2011 at 1:58 PM, Greyhart <greyhart at castle-luna.com<mailto:
>>> greyhart at castle-luna.**com <greyhart at castle-luna.com>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>    I think what both Sue and Katie are trying to get across, is that
>>>    it is
>>>    better to honor, worship, follow, whatever, the Gods who call you,
>>>    rather
>>>    than the God(s) your family expect(s) you to. I may be wrong on
>>>    that, but
>>>    that's what I'm getting from their posts.
>>>
>>>    Greyhart
>>>
>>>    -----Original Message-----
>>>    From: community-bounces at crodreoilin.**org<community-bounces at crodreoilin.org>
>>> <mailto:community-bounces@**crodreoilin.org<community-bounces at crodreoilin.org>
>>> >
>>>    [mailto:community-bounces@**crodreoilin.org<community-bounces at crodreoilin.org>
>>> <mailto:community-bounces@**crodreoilin.org<community-bounces at crodreoilin.org>>]
>>> On Behalf Of Kelley Forbes
>>>    Sent: Friday, November 25, 2011 12:01 PM
>>>    To: community at crodreoilin.org <mailto:community at crodreoilin.**org<community at crodreoilin.org>
>>> >
>>>    Cc: Kelley Forbes
>>>    Subject: Re: [Cro Dreoilin] "Shoulds"
>>>
>>>    I think wanting to do something is, truly, very important; it is,
>>>    however,
>>>    only peripherally related to what I was saying.
>>>
>>>    There are different parts that "wanting" can play when we are
>>>    talking about
>>>    living up to our values. We can want something physically or
>>>    emotionally or
>>>    mentally or spiritually/philosophically.  Sometimes those
>>>    different wants
>>>    can come into conflict.  We can, for instance, choose to do
>>>    something we
>>>    would otherwise not want to do, because we also want to live up a
>>>    certain
>>>    set of values.
>>>
>>>    The crux of it is that, even in this situation, we need to be able
>>>    to say
>>>    what value or values we are living up to.  When we are
>>>    specifically dealing
>>>    with aesthetic wants and choices, if we find ourselves
>>>    substituting the
>>>    "because it will ..." phrase with " ... because I want to," too
>>>    often, it
>>>    can be an indication that we are masking moralistic behavior.  In
>>>    this case,
>>>    "wanting" can mean the internalization of societal norms to the
>>>    point that
>>>    we can't separate our own choice from what we have been brought up to
>>>    believe is true.
>>>
>>>
>>>    -- Kelley.
>>>
>>>
>>>    Katie Murphy wrote:
>>> > I like what Sue said about this. I think that doing something out of
>>> > obligation isn't as meaningful as doing something because you
>>>    WANT to.
>>> >
>>> > --Katie
>>> >
>>> > On Sun, Nov 20, 2011 at 3:21 PM, sue blackmore
>>> > <sblackmore1966 at gmail.com <mailto:sblackmore1966 at gmail.**com<sblackmore1966 at gmail.com>
>>> >
>>> <mailto:sblackmore1966 at gmail.**com <sblackmore1966 at gmail.com>
>>> <mailto:sblackmore1966 at gmail.**com <sblackmore1966 at gmail.com>>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >     It has been said that the best reason to do anything is
>>>    because we
>>> >     want to. So we say please, step out of our comfort zone and
>>> >     venerate our gods not because we should or its polite or the
>>>    gods
>>> >     need it but because we want to.
>>> >
>>> >     On Nov 20, 2011 3:08 PM, "Charlotte Blackwood"
>>> > <charlotte.blackwood at gmail.com
>>> <mailto:charlotte.blackwood@**gmail.com <charlotte.blackwood at gmail.com>>
>>> > <mailto:charlotte.blackwood@**gmail.com<charlotte.blackwood at gmail.com>
>>> <mailto:charlotte.blackwood@**gmail.com <charlotte.blackwood at gmail.com>>>>
>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >         You are so cool :)  Thanks for that email :)
>>> >
>>> >         On 11/20/11, Kelley Forbes <forbesk at astronomytower.net
>>> <mailto:forbesk@**astronomytower.net <forbesk at astronomytower.net>>
>>> > <mailto:forbesk@**astronomytower.net <forbesk at astronomytower.net>
>>> <mailto:forbesk@**astronomytower.net <forbesk at astronomytower.net>>>>
>>> wrote:
>>> > > One interesting thing this topic of "needs" has me
>>>    thinking
>>> >         about is the
>>> > > place that "shoulds" have in our religion.
>>> > >
>>> > > In a values-based aesthetic, there are no independent
>>> >         "should" actions
>>> > > or rules; there are no "thou shalts" or "thou shalt nots".
>>> >         Every time
>>> > > you think of yourself as "having to" or "must" or "should
>>> >         do", then you
>>> > > should be able to complete the phrase "because it will
>>>    ____".
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > "I should open the door, because it is hospitable to
>>>    do so."
>>> > >
>>> > > "I should say 'please', because I am acknowledging the
>>>    right
>>> >         of the
>>> > > person to say no, and that builds independence and
>>>    community."
>>> > >
>>> > > "I should step out of my comfort zone, because it is
>>> >         courageous."
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > If you catch yourself having a bunch of "should" thoughts
>>> >         and not being
>>> > > able to complete that sentence, then you need to ask
>>> >         yourself what
>>> > > ethics you are caring around with you that are someone
>>> >         else's rules,
>>> > > most likely picked up from our decidedly moral-based
>>>    culture.
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > -- Kelley.
>>> > >
>>> > > ______________________________**_________________
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>>> >
>>> > --
>>> > "We've begun to long for the pitter-patter of little feet - so we
>>> > bought a dog. Well, it's cheaper, and you get more feet. "
>>> > ~Rita Rudner
>>> >
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>>>
>>> --
>>> "We've begun to long for the pitter-patter of little feet - so we bought
>>> a dog. Well, it's cheaper, and you get more feet. "
>>> ~Rita Rudner
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>>> ------------
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