[Cro Dreoilin] "Shoulds"
Kelley Forbes
forbesk at astronomytower.net
Thu Dec 1 16:01:03 MST 2011
So two questions:
1. What values do your answers represent?
2. Why should you worship the Gods that call to you rather than, say,
Gods you have chosen? -- or picked randomly out of a hat? You have an
answer in "they will be pissed"; is there more to it than that?
-- Kelley.
Sebastian wrote:
> I should follow the god(s) that call to me because I respect them and
> wish to build a lasting relationship with them.
> Or in some cases, "I should follow the god(s) that call to me because
> otherwise they will be pissed."
>
> On Sat, Nov 26, 2011 at 9:16 AM, Donna Miller <dmiller at faerealm.com
> <mailto:dmiller at faerealm.com>> wrote:
>
> Okay, let me go at it. I do not follow Celtic spiritual
> traditions, being more drawn to ancient Persian spiritual
> traditions. I follow Celtic musical traditions which is tied into
> Celtic spirituality no matter what the Irish will tell you. I
> still know nothing about the Celtic reconstructionist traditions
> other than what Chris and Kelly taught us at the Jeffco CUUPS event.
>
> My own take on religion is that it exists, not for the god(s)'s
> sake but for the purpose of building society. The rules of the
> religion will mirror the religious community's strongest values,
> not the other way around. What "offends the god" is what disrupts
> society. Religion exists for man, not for god(dess)(s). Yet the
> worship of a god strengthens the value that said god represents.
>
> What are the shoulds that build Celtic Reconstructionist society?
> You are very open in belief but there should be guidelines set
> down that are forbidden. Usually they have more to do to the
> needs of the people in it than the tradition at hand.
>
> Enlighten me.
>
> DSM
>
>
> On 11/26/2011 8:39 AM, Kelley Forbes wrote:
>
> Alrighty, let's play the game:
>
> "You should follow the God(s) that you feel call to you,"
> because -- ?
>
>
> -- Kelley & Chris.
>
> Katie Murphy wrote:
>
> Yes, definitely, you should follow the God(s) that you
> feel call to you, rather than the God(s) that your
> parents/family/what have you expect you to follow/worship.
> Like, Brad's parents expect him to be Christian but it was
> never really true to him.
>
> However, I can understand the importance of stopping and
> checking ourselves for outside (say, Christian) moralistic
> views when it comes to approaching daily life and our Gods.
>
> On Fri, Nov 25, 2011 at 1:58 PM, Greyhart
> <greyhart at castle-luna.com
> <mailto:greyhart at castle-luna.com>
> <mailto:greyhart at castle-luna.com
> <mailto:greyhart at castle-luna.com>>> wrote:
>
> I think what both Sue and Katie are trying to get
> across, is that
> it is
> better to honor, worship, follow, whatever, the Gods
> who call you,
> rather
> than the God(s) your family expect(s) you to. I may be
> wrong on
> that, but
> that's what I'm getting from their posts.
>
> Greyhart
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: community-bounces at crodreoilin.org
> <mailto:community-bounces at crodreoilin.org>
> <mailto:community-bounces at crodreoilin.org
> <mailto:community-bounces at crodreoilin.org>>
> [mailto:community-bounces at crodreoilin.org
> <mailto:community-bounces at crodreoilin.org>
> <mailto:community-bounces at crodreoilin.org
> <mailto:community-bounces at crodreoilin.org>>] On Behalf Of
> Kelley Forbes
> Sent: Friday, November 25, 2011 12:01 PM
> To: community at crodreoilin.org
> <mailto:community at crodreoilin.org>
> <mailto:community at crodreoilin.org
> <mailto:community at crodreoilin.org>>
> Cc: Kelley Forbes
> Subject: Re: [Cro Dreoilin] "Shoulds"
>
> I think wanting to do something is, truly, very
> important; it is,
> however,
> only peripherally related to what I was saying.
>
> There are different parts that "wanting" can play when
> we are
> talking about
> living up to our values. We can want something
> physically or
> emotionally or
> mentally or spiritually/philosophically. Sometimes those
> different wants
> can come into conflict. We can, for instance, choose to do
> something we
> would otherwise not want to do, because we also want to
> live up a
> certain
> set of values.
>
> The crux of it is that, even in this situation, we need
> to be able
> to say
> what value or values we are living up to. When we are
> specifically dealing
> with aesthetic wants and choices, if we find ourselves
> substituting the
> "because it will ..." phrase with " ... because I want
> to," too
> often, it
> can be an indication that we are masking moralistic
> behavior. In
> this case,
> "wanting" can mean the internalization of societal
> norms to the
> point that
> we can't separate our own choice from what we have been
> brought up to
> believe is true.
>
>
> -- Kelley.
>
>
> Katie Murphy wrote:
> > I like what Sue said about this. I think that doing
> something out of
> > obligation isn't as meaningful as doing something
> because you
> WANT to.
> >
> > --Katie
> >
> > On Sun, Nov 20, 2011 at 3:21 PM, sue blackmore
> > <sblackmore1966 at gmail.com
> <mailto:sblackmore1966 at gmail.com>
> <mailto:sblackmore1966 at gmail.com
> <mailto:sblackmore1966 at gmail.com>>
> <mailto:sblackmore1966 at gmail.com
> <mailto:sblackmore1966 at gmail.com>
> <mailto:sblackmore1966 at gmail.com
> <mailto:sblackmore1966 at gmail.com>>>> wrote:
> >
> > It has been said that the best reason to do anything is
> because we
> > want to. So we say please, step out of our comfort
> zone and
> > venerate our gods not because we should or its
> polite or the
> gods
> > need it but because we want to.
> >
> > On Nov 20, 2011 3:08 PM, "Charlotte Blackwood"
> > <charlotte.blackwood at gmail.com
> <mailto:charlotte.blackwood at gmail.com>
> <mailto:charlotte.blackwood at gmail.com
> <mailto:charlotte.blackwood at gmail.com>>
> > <mailto:charlotte.blackwood at gmail.com
> <mailto:charlotte.blackwood at gmail.com>
> <mailto:charlotte.blackwood at gmail.com
> <mailto:charlotte.blackwood at gmail.com>>>> wrote:
> >
> > You are so cool :) Thanks for that email :)
> >
> > On 11/20/11, Kelley Forbes
> <forbesk at astronomytower.net
> <mailto:forbesk at astronomytower.net>
> <mailto:forbesk at astronomytower.net
> <mailto:forbesk at astronomytower.net>>
> > <mailto:forbesk at astronomytower.net
> <mailto:forbesk at astronomytower.net>
> <mailto:forbesk at astronomytower.net
> <mailto:forbesk at astronomytower.net>>>> wrote:
> > > One interesting thing this topic of "needs" has me
> thinking
> > about is the
> > > place that "shoulds" have in our religion.
> > >
> > > In a values-based aesthetic, there are no independent
> > "should" actions
> > > or rules; there are no "thou shalts" or "thou shalt nots".
> > Every time
> > > you think of yourself as "having to" or "must" or "should
> > do", then you
> > > should be able to complete the phrase "because it will
> ____".
> > >
> > >
> > > "I should open the door, because it is hospitable to
> do so."
> > >
> > > "I should say 'please', because I am acknowledging the
> right
> > of the
> > > person to say no, and that builds independence and
> community."
> > >
> > > "I should step out of my comfort zone, because it is
> > courageous."
> > >
> > >
> > > If you catch yourself having a bunch of "should" thoughts
> > and not being
> > > able to complete that sentence, then you need to ask
> > yourself what
> > > ethics you are caring around with you that are someone
> > else's rules,
> > > most likely picked up from our decidedly moral-based
> culture.
> > >
> > >
> > > -- Kelley.
> > >
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> > "We've begun to long for the pitter-patter of little
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> > ~Rita Rudner
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